Awesome game, unfortunate impression

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Awesome game, unfortunate impression

Postby Winkzy » Thu Oct 01, 2009 7:00 pm

I finished EE about a week ago and was awe struck by how great this game was, kudos! I was also struck with an impression that I didn't expect. Maybe I'm reading way too much into my observations but I thought I'd air my thoughts.

Unfortunately the impression I got was that there's possibly a homophobic subtext to the game (hopefully I'm wrong). The first head scratching moment that hit me was when the fairy companion Joelle says she's married, Downey then exclaims "That's Gross" because they both appeared female. Joelle explains they're not a same-sex couple but it doesn't change the disgust Downey expresses at the thought. Downey also has issues with Jean outside of their rivalry.

Jean has effeminate qualities and as a result is constantly bullied and harassed throughout the first half of the game. He is teased by Downey and emasculated by Fiero who thinks he's a women. This subplot culminates during a side quest when Jean cross-dresses at the strip club (donning the sexy corset).

Finally there's the antagonist of the story, Rishi, serpent of persuasion. We find out later this source of evil is also known as Vaghat. I'm sure there are a couple of ways to workout the pronunciation but it clearly could be pronounced as follows: Va-ghat... sounds allot like Faggot.

Honestly I thought the back and forth between Downey and Jean added depth to the characters and had great comedic value, within a non-bias context. The only reason these observations blipped my radar at all is that the storyline of Eden is clearly a Christian allegory. Some constituents of the Christian community (mostly evangelicals) have a certain opinion of homosexuality. Many in that community feel it is an amoral choice (serpent of persuasion?) rather than genetic predisposition. I hope that I'm connecting dots that are just coincidental but I'm taking the risk of sounding foolish and broaching the subject.

I want to repeat that I enjoyed this game immensely and I'm not attacking anyone. I'm just hoping for some clarity without the dialog getting ugly.
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Re: Awesome game, unfortunate impression

Postby Elder » Thu Oct 01, 2009 9:51 pm

In the original version of Eternal Eden (before it got censored) Jean is burnt alive on a crucifix by Downey. joking (Haha).

Honestly, when people ask me if I’m homophobe I generally reply: I’m not homophobe BUT I’m not homophile either. :P

In general I accept homosexuality around me and I never felt disdain for any gay. I actually lived with a couple of homosexuals some years ago and I had a lot of fun with them. The nicest thing is that together we made tons of contextual jokes about homosexuality. They were never offended and to me it proved they fully accepted their sexual orientation.

When I say I’m not homophile it means that I will not open a red carpet under gays’ feet and become involved in parades. Also, if my best friend, my sister or my future children announce me they are gay, they have to expect a reaction from me to digest the news. Acceptance will not become 'instant', especially not with people I expect it the less. But don’t worry I will not ban them from my life even if I will never fully comprehend their motivation. I will do my best to make them feel good if they truly accept they are meant to be different.

I hope I can dissipate your doubts about Eternal Eden on this subject :D

Besides, in Eternal Eden I used some ‘light’ humor and it was oriented toward virility rather than homosexuality.

About Linette and Joelle, I thought making fairies without gender was a nice touch. Downey is someone arrogant; it has to be expected from him to have ‘bitching’ reactions against things that aren’t common. It added more dimension to his personality.

Thank you for the nice words, I’m always extremely happy to hear positive feedbacks from fans.

P.S. Pardon my poor English.
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Re: Awesome game, unfortunate impression

Postby Winkzy » Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:46 pm

Elder,
I'm glad you were not offended by my observations. I debated with myself over posting my thoughts because it is such a great game, I lose quite a few arguments with myself :D . I'm sure you are very proud of Eternal Eden as well you should be. I've played allot of RPG maker games and yours is by far the most engrossing, satisfying and funny one I've played yet.

I guess I sort of zeroed in on those thoughts because I grew up in the San Francisco bay area (East Bay) around allot of liberal minded people. Contrary to any speculation you sound like a open minded thoughtful person with a great sense of humor.

It must have been the religious component that fogged my vision because I'm actually a fan of edgy and politically in-correct humor. The Linette/Joelle twist and Downey's ball-busting on Jean is very funny in a context without hidden hate or malice.

Similarly to yourself I have a "live and let live" attitude towards the issue of gay rights and homosexuality. Thank you for taking the time to relay your thoughts and for not being defensive to my musing. The last thing I wanted was to come across as a troll or radical.

Eagerly Awaiting Eternal Eden II,
Winkzy
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Re: Awesome game, unfortunate impression

Postby Elder » Fri Oct 02, 2009 5:01 am

Besides,

Winkzy wrote:Finally there's the antagonist of the story, Rishi, serpent of persuasion. We find out later this source of evil is also known as Vaghat. I'm sure there are a couple of ways to workout the pronunciation but it clearly could be pronounced as follows: Va-ghat... sounds allot like Faggot.


you can learn more about the inspiration behinds Rishi (aka Vaghat) there,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rishi

I have a book called Rishi at home, that's why I decided to use Rishi for Eternal Eden.
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Re: Awesome game, unfortunate impression

Postby IkimashoZ » Sat Oct 03, 2009 4:06 am

I experienced similar feelings while playing through EE, especially during the scene with Downey that you mentioned. My eventual interpretation was that Downey was something of an insensitive jerk, and the other character's reactions to him make that clear. To be completely honest though, this scene did bug me a bit. Reading it was sort of like, "Eww, bigotry, yuck." But, I think if people are forced to face these kinds of situations in an appropriate context, in the end it's a good thing. Personally though, I would have appreciated it if Joelle had said something to the effect of: "Wow, Downey. Way to be a giant homophobic jerk."
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Re: Awesome game, unfortunate impression

Postby sonic_reaper » Fri Nov 13, 2009 8:21 pm

I too got a similar vibe/reaction. I've actually been somewhat heavily involved with the gay community here where I live, and like Elder, I've joked around a lot with the people in the community, of course, all in good jest. The comments only stuck out to me because undoubtedly many people who play/will play Eternal Eden may not come into the scenes with the same level of comfort or understanding of homosexual people/culture. While it didn't bug me personally, I can see how it may possibly often others. It's just something to be more careful/mindful of in the future.
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Re: Awesome game, unfortunate impression

Postby Neko Hibiki » Fri Jan 01, 2010 4:59 am

Downey reminds me a lot of Ron Weasley though.

As for the gay thing.

I myself am pansexual here.

So I don't mind gay folks any.

I like guys, girls, herms, shemales, and every other gender that exist under the sun.
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